Item was sent to wrong address - paypal ruled in seller's favour

[meowth23]

I used Paypal checkout with an online merchant, and seems like Paypal "auto-filled" my shipping address with

#200-1850 Airport Exchange Blvd

Erlanger, KY

If I recall correctly, it did so because there was an error message at the top indicating the merchant only ships to US addresses (the merchant does ship internationally per their website - RugsUSA). I also entered my Canadian home address under the "Note to Seller" and my paypal e-mail confirmation clearly shows this address. I thought this was clear enough that Paypal would pass this information on to the seller, and if there was a problem with this address, that I would be contacted.

The merchant provided me a Fedex tracking number for the Erlanger address, and it shows that it was delivered there on Feb 28th. I have heard absolutely nothing since then. I contacted the seller, and they said they only have the Erlanger address on file, no Canadian address. I phoned Pitney Bowes (the Erlanger address belongs to this global shipping company apparently) and then they insisted that my package must have been returned to the seller, since they could not find my order # in their system and that there is no way they could have forwarded my package to my Canadian address without a reference # from the seller (seller said they did not have this reference #).

The seller did not receive any returned package apparently, and basically said they cannot help me any further as they did their part by sending it to the Erlanger facility.

I opened a claim with Paypal, but they ruled in the seller's favour because they were able to provide the proof of delivery to the Erlanger, KY address (NOT my home address). I'm not sure how this is fair, because I clearly indicated that I lived in Canada.

I already phoned Paypal, and the rep told me to show them a copy of my email confirmation showing my Canada address, which I did - they still refused to refund me, repeating the fact that the seller provided proof of delivery (proof of delivery to an address that is not my home address! As I had already explained to them on the phone). I am furious that I am out $200 and no item, and I am at a loss at what to do now.

The only thing I'm possibly thinking is to contact Pitney Bowes again through e-mail this time, and have them explain that they could not have forwarded the package to me, and then forward that correspondence to Paypal as proof of non-delivery. 

[sharpiemarker]

Since on your PayPal receipt your home address was not the designated shipping address, instead the Erlanger, Ky address was, then you are not covered or lost the case.  Under seller protection program the seller has to ship to the shipping address.  They did the right thing to be covered for INR disputes. The better option was to exit the checkout where possible without completing order or contact the seller to cancel order if the mailing address was not right.

Did you buy off of eBay?  They are the only ones doing this global shipping thing with Pitney that I know of.  If you funded payment with credit card, you could try filing a chargeback.  Seller protection program should cover seller from item not received chargeback if they met the requirements to be covered on a PayPal dispute.

[meowth23]

If PB is saying they can't find my parcel in their system and that there is no way they could have shipped it to me and that it was returned to seller, and the seller is saying there is no returned parcel and they did not generate a reference number for PB, would this communication not be enough proof of non delivery? I have emails of this correspondence. My purchase was funded from my bank account, could I dispute the charge with the bank?

[sharpiemarker]

PayPal goes by tracking information showing delivered by the carrier the seller used.  

But nothing is stopping you from using your argument to make your appeal to PayPal or even dispute the payment with your bank. Can't speculate on whether you'll win or not or able to get your bank to reverse the payment.  

I think maybe what happened was, could the Erlanger address already be in your PayPal address list and the address wasn't updated during checkout to your home address?  Check your address list on your Profile page.  And have you made a purchase  through eBay via Global Shipping Program before?  Could be how the Erlanger address got into your address list.

[meowth23]

Not impossible, as I have bought items off ebay before, but I feel like I would have an email log or at least some memory of using GSP, neither of which I have.

Here's the really weird part.

I was trying to provide screenshots to paypal of what I was seeing on my screen during checkout. Yesterday, I got to paypal checkout and it auto-selected the Erlanger KY address.

But just now when I was trying to go through the entire paypal checkout process once again, the Erlanger KY address has now vanished from my paypal address history. I have a screenshot of this. I couldn't have deleted this - my paypal summary only shows my default address (and not the 4 or so other outdated addresses that always seem to pop up during checkout, which I could never figure out how to remove myself, including this Erlanger address).

I don't know if I'm going completely bonkers, but I just want my money and sanity back.

Seems like Paypal is insisting the seller provided tracking and proof of delivery to Erlanger, therefore case closed. Which I understand to an extent, but I don't feel this case is black and white - my parcel only made it halfway. The rest of my story doesn't seem to matter. Really hoping my bank will side with me on this...

[Whac-A-Mole]

where did you make the purchase,the seller own website or Ebay?

This sound like Ebay's  GSP global shipping program case,where seller shipped to Erlanger ,kentucky and GSP ship to you in Canada.

Now,if this is an Ebay transaction,you should get a bill from GSP asking you to pay the intl shipping cost-their fee,Canadian tarriffs/custom duty and the shipping cost from Kentucy to Canada.

IF YOU HAVE paid that GSP bill,then it has a record of your Canadian address and it will take the seller package,repack it and ship to Canada,I understand GSP ships to Canada in bulk by freight or train,not sure?

But it sounds like you did not get a bill from GSP,so could it be you bougt it from his website(not ebay) and he just sent the package to KEntucky.

But the folks in Kentucky has no clue why they get this package and dont know what to do,either they would return to sender,wait or worse,sell it to a local dealer who sells them on Ebay!

You need to contact the seller and have him deal with GSP,if he sold it on his website,he should not be using GSP,since it is only for Ebay transactions,tell him to ask GSP TO track them that package and ask where it is,he must have signed up with GSP either with his website ID or Ebay seller ID. 

This is not your fault or GSP fault,it is your seller not understanding how GSP works,

[meowth23]

It was from the seller's own website unfortunately. And no I did not get a bill from GSP. Like sharpiemarker said, it looks like they simply shipped it to Kentucky as it was the address indicated as the shipping address. Folks in Kentucky said they could not find anything in their system, and also said I needed that reference # from the seller, which was never provided, so it's likely they returned to seller. 

The PB rep even tried to track down my parcel based on the description and date it was signed for (it would have been a large rug, but even then she said the employee would only sign for the bulk container, and not the individual item) still couldn't find anything.

Seller doesn't even seem to know what the Kentucky address is either which is also frustrating. Just kept repeating that it was the only address they had on file. So I'm really confused as to how this address was entered for me in the first place. I made the mistake of assuming that it was a forwarding address chosen by Paypal, and that as long as I put my actual address in the Note To Seller section, I would be covered, that Paypal and/or the merchant would see this (it is literally called Note to Seller right?) and that someone would recognize the KY address as the GSP address. Totally wrong....

[Whac-A-Mole]

Many websites sell on Ebay as well,so I am not surprised yours do and use GSP for intl shipment.

Unfortunately,you bought it on his website ,it is his lack of understanding of GSP which caused this problem.

So,your seller should contact Erlanger folks and ask them to find this rug.

Now GSP does repack the goods ,sometimes they find out it exceeds the size limit or import/exporty restriction(like certain wood in Thomson guitar are not allowed to be exported from USA),they will refund the buyer (not the seller) and then sell it t o a local dealer who sells them on EBay or his local store.

But in your case,they have no record of your payment ,like they said it is not in their system,but the rug cannot disappear,your seller should find out where is the rug,it cant be the only item they cant ship,so there could be a warehouse where these items sit!

it should have the seller return address,someone would have to find it.

But for you,you can file a chargeback with your cc issuer and tell them you never receive the item,it was shipped to an address in Kentucky and you live in Canada,thats all you need to show,if your seller wants to win the case,he would have to produce tracking showing it has been shipped and delivered to Canada.

The KENTUCKY ADDRESS shows up in your payment is due to GSP,he signs up for GSP and that address is filled in so it can be shipped to Kentucy and he will get seller protection for item not received.  

[meowth23]

I will have to approach my bank for this, but I'm scared they will say the same thing Paypal did - that the seller did their part and provided proof of delivery to Erlanger KY, despite my indication that I live in Canada, and despite PB not finding the order in their system. Because that's all it took for the seller to win this case.

[Whac-A-Mole]

Did you pay with a credit card or bank fund?

If credit card,then look up the charge and file chargeback,reason-item not received,dont give the whole story of Paypal or GSP,it would just add more muddle into the case.

,then your cc issuer will notify Paypal a chargeback has been filed,reason,-you did not receive the item.

Paypal will then notify seller of this chargeback and ask him to gather his side of the story,Or since he won the Paypal dispute,Paypal could present his tracking number to Erlanger,kentucy to your cc issuer.

Your cc issuer clerk will review both sides of the story and decide who wins,and it should be you ,since you dont live in Kentucky.

A chargeback fee of $20 (if USA) will be charged to Paypal,since your seller is protected by Paypal seller protection,Paypal would have to eat the loss plus the $20 penalty.

This is an interesting case,GSP is for Ebay sellers,who sells on Ebay,although your seller is an Ebay seller,but the item was sold on his website,Ebay did not get a dime from the sale,Ebay is not involved.

GSP is not involved either,it knows nothing about this sale,it was never informed by the seller to ship anything to Canada,neither did they get any payment from you to ship?

So what did GSP do when a parcel comes in and they dont know what to do with it?

Your seller has already won the case on Paypal so it looks like PAYPAL has to honor its seller protection policy and eat the loss unless it know enough about GSP and the seller abuses GSP .