Sellers scam buyers supported by Paypal!

[PhilM64]

Why are PayPal making it so easy for sellers to scam these days? All a seller has to do when a dispute is raised Is keep asking for photos, even if they have received them. PayPal then closes the dispute. No questions asked. I think it is time to stop using eBay and PayPal.

[kernowlass]

@PhilM64 

If you open a dispute then you have up to 20 days to escalate to a claim or it auto closes, so did you escalate?

The dispute phase is for negotiations between you and the seller, if that does not work out then you have to escalate to a claim for Paypal to get involved.

[PhilM64]

Yes, I escalated, and in the escalation notes I called out the scammer for counterfeit products and continually asking for video/photo’s despite having them.

Didn’t stop PayPal protecting it’s commission

[kernowlass]

@PhilM64 

Well you getting a refund would not protect paypals commission as the fee the seller pays is not returned when any refund is made.

However in the case of an item received but not as described dispute the ''only'' proof of fake goods that paypal accept is a hand printed note from the manufacturer of the item OR a store that sells the genuine article, they don't have time to view videos etc.

As you didn't provide that presumably? then the only decision paypal then make IF they find in your favour is to return everything you received back to the seller for a full refund (trackable and at your own expense), did they offer you that option? If they didn't and you didn't prove the goods were fake then you would sadly lose out.

Paypal do not get involved with ''quality'' issues so if you bought a bag and received a bag then they would rule for the seller even if it was fake tat from China bought via Social Media? That is unless you can provide the proof as per above.

If you funded your paypal payment via a credit card then maybe check if they can chargeback for you?

[PhilM64]

The seller has moved to the next stage of their scam, namely asking for the crap they sent me to be returned by mail at my expense. Normally it is not worth our time to return and they keep the money and we are stuck with the crap they sent us. In anticipation of their next step in the strategy I have asked them to confirm the exact address I can return the goods to and they have replied 3 times without an address. The real issue here is PayPal continues to be complicit with these fraudsters when they could easily turn off the frauds with the push of a button as soon as they get a complaint, however knowing the next person they scam and the one after that generates PayPal revenue why would they? If PayPal made it clear they would not tolerate scams and make the frauds suffer by keeping their money and making them pay for returns the scammers would give up, but unfortunately for PayPal, scammers are a big part of their revenue model!

[PhilM64]

So how do you return the counterfeit goods to the scam PayPal partner when neither PayPal or its Scammer Partner will give you the address to send it to?

[PayPal_Meghan]

Hello @PhilM64, @kernowlass, and @Lisak1234, 

Welcome to the PayPal Community, @PhilM64 and @Lisak1234! I'd also like to thank @kernowlass for providing information on refunds and disputes. I understand you have some additional questions about the Dispute & Claim process, and I'll be happy to help. 

@PhilM64, I'm sorry to hear that there has been a lot of back and forth in your case, and you've recently been asked to return the item before you can receive a refund. If you were asked to return the item through your case, PayPal would have emailed you the return address. In that situation, the item would have to be returned to the address within the email to receive a refund. If the address isn't in a different language, you can reach out to our Customer Support to request a translation before shipping. Through our Buyer Protection policy, we are unable to cover the cost of return shipping. However, if you had paid for shipping with your initial purchase, that would be part of your full refund upon return of the item. You can learn more about PayPal's Buyer Protection Policy on our Help Center here: Does PayPal cover my purchase if there's a problem?

@Lisak1234, I understand that your recent case was closed the day after it was opened. I apologize for the frustration this has caused you. If tracking was supplied by the seller that showed delivery, our system might have closed it automatically. However, you can still appeal the case if you didn't receive the item. I recommend contacting your local shipping carrier to confirm the delivery. If they can provide you with a letter/statement that shows it wasn't delivered to you, we can use that to open an appeal. If the tracking within the case still doesn't show delivery at all, please alert Customer Support right away. If you had received something that wasn't the correct item, even if that's an empty envelope, they'd also be able to help you update your case to a Significantly Not As Described claim. 

You can contact Support by clicking 'Contact' at the bottom of any PayPal page. Customer Support is also available if you send a DM to @AskPayPal on Twitter, a PM to facebook.com/PayPal, or a DM on Instagram at instagram.com/PayPal. I hope this information helps both of you obtain a refund soon! 

- Meghan

[PhilM64]

Meghan, Thank you for the reply. Whilst extremely articulate, you have completely missed the point of my original post, and the comments of others have had supporting it. PayPal do everything they can to protect sellers, which I understand with honourable sellers, however, I would contend that a material percentage of sellers that use PayPal, generally through eBay or Instagram posts are indeed, counterfeiters or frauds knowing it is often too hard or not worth the cost of returning the junk they send, they count on it! Both eBay and PayPal should have a big red flag button that allows registered parties to lodge said flag which would immediately start a process of review. If say more than five independent and obviously qualified members complain “qualified because we are registered with PayPal” . It should be sufficient for PayPal to freeze all activity to and from the potential scammers account at which time the scammer gets shut down. PayPal could quite easily rub out this fraudulent activity but simply chooses not to because the scammers are a key part of their revenue model! Like so many others I am seriously exploring and dealing with credible alternatives to both PayPal and Ebay in Amazon. To be frank, eBay and PayPal only have them self to blame. For the record, I still see adverts everyday from the scammers under multiple different companies and it infuriates me to think of the amount of people that are being ripped off by them with your support!

[Lisak1234]

I opened a claim and it was closed the next day. I bought items off of marketplace after the scum bag printed a label to ship and it still hasn’t shipped. I looked up her Facebook posts and it appears she’s scamming a lot of people.

[PhilM64]

The problem is, the scammer industry is the lifeblood of the PayPal/eBay business Model. Try selling a CPAP machine and the system rejects your efforts- sell a counterfeit Handbag, or rip off a Viking lift by putting a red box over their logo or use a Woodpecker Tools video then send complete junk and PayPal make it hard to lodge a claim that is supported because the scammers have it down pat. Once the dispute is cancelled in the scammers favour it is almost impossible to further dispute it when they scam the decision.