Formal complaint not possible??

[LED777]

Hi guys I wanted to enter a formal complaint after a very bad experience with a fake online shop. They told me to send everything back to Pakistan. I never got any money and opened a dispute. It was closed by PayPal in favour of the seller although I had lots of proof. PayPal never reacted to any questions. They closed my chat windows and I never reached anyone by phone although waiting for a while. So I wanted to open a formal complaint. Got an automated message: That service is not available! I am more than **bleep**. Does anyone of you guys know what I can do?

[PayPal_Bindu]

Hello @LED777

Thank you for your post and welcome to our community forum!

We apologize for the negative experience that you have had with us and it's not something we want our customers to have. You can submit a formal complaint by clicking the contact us option and then choosing Feedback and formal complaints option. 

You can appeal the outcome of the case within 10 days of case closure. Please contact us by clicking the contact us option at the bottom of PayPal page or send us a message through our Twitter(@AskPayPal) and Facebook page for additional assistance on appealing the case.

Bindu

[LED777]

@PayPal_Bindu Hi there. Thank you for your reply. I had already read about the process for formal complaining but in my case I don't have the option of 'Feedback and formal complaint'. I have the very strong feeling some machine learning algorithm stops me from complaining, using the chat system etc. I have tried so many ways to get in touch with PayPal employees and to have my case reviewed. Nothing works. I cannot reach anyone by phone, when using the chat system I either do not get any reply or someone promises me to transfer my complaint. But then nothing happens. Can you understand how I feel? I am a student, I lost more than 400 USD to some fraudulent seller and I cannot do anything about it? PayPal promised me protection. Well, I cannot see it! And I am getting tired of writing and trying. But I want that money back! I had provided PayPal everything to check my case. Why do you support online stores that trick people into buying rubbish and then providing fake addresses for retourning? You should stop them! I thought that was your mission?!

[kernowlass]

@LED777 

Scam Web Sites or Social Media ads easy to spot (once you know the below signs) so buyer beware.

Paypal would not be able to check every individual seller / merchant / company in over 200 countries worldwide that adds paypal to their website to accept payments.

So they give some buyer and some seller protection. However that protection can never be a 100% coverall so you need to read it so you can risk assess your transactions.

They do stop bad companies from using Paypal when enough claims start rolling in.
However as they are in China (mostly) then its easy for them to just start over with a new name, so stopping them does not really do anything.

The best thing is to not buy from them in the first place, to recognise them -

1. No return address on the returns policy. The site will look as if its in your country (where they despatch goods from) but they will ask for returns to go back to China (returns depot) at a shipping cost often more than the item is worth.
2. No contact telephone number. if you click on contact the most you will get is webmail or an email address.
3. Rarely company address information.
4. Great pictures of items at bargain prices that turn out to be tat.
5. Fake reviews.
6. Google and you can often see previous company names as they change them once enough claims roll in and Paypal stop them using their services and start over.
7. Send fake tracking numbers to win item non receipt of item claims.

If you opened a dispute and won then paypal would tell you the address to send the item back to and as soon as you provide them with a tracking number to prove delivery you should get your refund. If you decide to send the item back yourself between you and the seller and do not send with tracking and open a dispute later then sadly you would lose.

[LED777]

@kernowlass Thank you for your reply. I am fully aware PayPal cannot check every seller. Also I checked the website I ordered from and it looked totally fine on first glance. PayPal always wants you to get in touch with the seller first, what I did. We found an agreement, I sent the stuff back. Then the seller claimed he never received anything and later I found out the address he had provided me did not exist. You are suggesting PayPal just provides protection to SOME sellers and SOME buyers. In that case I suggest they should stop mentioning their famous protection for EVERYBODY. It's just a joke then. I am pretty sure no one ever looked at my case. Also I was quite surprised to find out to how many people using PayPal happened the very same. So I am not the only one. Also I read about other honest SELLERS, using PayPal just once or twice, who lost their cases. I guess PayPal earns very little here, so they do not care. My seller - for sure - owns more than one of those online stores so if PayPal wants to continue earning money here they better support them. The sellers pay the fees, that's how PayPal survives. I am sure you are familiar with that.

[kernowlass]

@LED777 

I didn't say they protect some buyers and some seller, I said they give 'some' buyer and 'some' seller protection dependent on their policies in the user agreement, they can't give you a 100% coverall, even your credit card does not offer that.

You opened a dispute and chose to come to an agreement with the merchant. So you sent the item back.

If you didn't trust the merchant to refund you then you had the option to send trackable OR escalate the dispute to a claim, as Paypal are only involved once it becomes a claim, then they would have told you to return the item and you could have used the 'return shipping on us' option to claim some or all of those shipping costs back again.

Sellers pay fees yes, but without buyers they would have nothing to sell and so would not accept any payments to provide those fees, I am sure you are aware of that?

Sorry you got scammed, but you chose to sort it out yourself in the dispute phase and sadly lost out. You would not have lost out if you had sent trackable and had a tracking number to give paypal.

The forum helpers always happy to give advice if you are not sure how things work or want advice on what to do.

[LED777]

@kernowlass I opened the dispute when the seller refused to refund me, not before. I had already shipped everything and by then I didn't know the return address was fake. Also I provided the tracking number. As I told you many others share my destiny. This discussion is not helping. I will not use PayPal again and I advice everybody to stay away from it. By the way: my credit card company would have transferred the money back. They offer proper customer protection. Sadly I would have had to claim the money within one month. In future I better rely on them than on companies like PayPal.

[kernowlass]

@LED777 

ok